Education And Holistic Health With Dr. Jeff Grognet 0:02

• Jeff Grognet Sold His Medical Practice Two Years Ago to Focus Full-Time on Holistic Education.

Holistic Vet Medicine And Vaccine Longevity 1:24

• Dr. Jeff Emphasizes the Importance of Holistic Veterinary Treatment to Overcome the Veterinarian Shortage and Meet Pet Care Demand.
• According to Dr. Jeff Grognet, Dog Vaccines Can Last Up to 9 Years and Possibly a Lifetime, Challenging the Need for Annual Boosters.
• Dr. Jeff Grognet Proposes a Mindset Shift in the Veterinary Business to Decrease Annual Check-Ups and Vaccines, Potentially Resolving the "Veterinary Crisis" Within a Year.
• Dr. Jeff Grognet Says the American Animal Hospital Association and World Small Animal Veterinary Association Recommend 9-Year Dog Vaccinations.
• Titers Can Extend Vaccines Intervals Beyond 9 Years, but the Process Differs From Standard Vaccination Schedules.

Vaccine Immunity And Titer Testing In Dogs 8:57

• Vaccines Develop a "Memory" of Immunity, Providing Lifetime Protection Against Some Diseases, According to Dr. Jeff Grognet.
• Jeff Grognet and Rob Ryan Explore "Memory" in Vaccine Development, with Dr. Jeff Grognet Providing Examples of How Vaccines Work to Generate Immunity in the Body.
• Jeff Grognet Suggests That Vaccinating Dogs Every Three Years Is Unnecessary and May Cause False Security, as Their Immune System May Still Protect Them Even If Antibody Levels Drop Below Detectable Levels.
• Jeff Grognet Has Never Witnessed a Vaccinated Dog Die from a Disease Despite Inconsistent Annual Vaccines.

Vaccine Safety And Efficacy In Dogs 14:45

• A Veterinarian Discusses the Controversy Over Vaccine Safety and Effectiveness in Dogs.
• Jeff Grognet Highlights Vaccination Hazards, Including Bone Inflammation, Joint Swelling, Hemolytic Anemia, and How Conventional Vets Disregard Them.
• Jeff Grognet Discusses Over-Vaccination in Cats, Including Tumor Growth, and How Conventional Vets Fail to Handle It.
• Jeff Grognet Stated a 10-fold Increase in Cancer Cases in Some Dog Breeds, Such as Golden Retrievers and Bernese Mountain Dogs.
• According to Dr. Jeff Grognet, the Narrow Gene Pool from Popular Breeding may contribute to Greater Cancer Rates in Some Breeds.

Vaccine Reactions And Allergies In Dogs 22:29

• Rob Ryan Questions the Need for Vaccines and Their Negative Effects, While Dr. Jeff Grognet Worries About Using Benadryl as a Treatment.
• Rob Ryan Indicates That Vaccinating a Dog with Allergies Can Worsen and Prolong Their Symptoms.
• Jeff Grognet Thinks Vaccines Can Cause an Overactive Immune System, Leading to Allergies. He Proposes Scheduling Vaccinations During Fewer Allergy-Prone Seasons.

Dog Allergies, Vaccines, And Parasiticides 27:17

• Jeff Grognet's Dog Inherits Dietary and Environmental Sensitivities from His Mother.
• Rob Ryan Describes His Pet Vaccination and Parasite Prevention E-Book.
• Jeff Grognet Describes the Adverse Effects of Bravecto, a Flea Pesticide, on Dogs, Including Seizures.
• According to Dr. Jeff Grognet, There Is Little Data on the Blood Levels of Bravecto in Dogs, Which May Not Be Sufficient for Comprehensive Flea Control.

Pet Flea And Tick Treatments And Their Potential Risks 34:17

• Jeff Grognet Recounts a Vehicle Accident Involving a Woman Who Used a Topical Flea Treatment on Her Dogs.
• Jeff Grognet Discusses the Past Use of Toxic Flea and Tick Products, Including "Flicks" That Were Only Effective for a Day.
• Jeff Grognet and Rob Ryan Examine the Pros and Cons of Modern Flea and Tick Products, with Grognet Cautioning That Future Generations May Be Surprised by Their Possible Health Hazards.

Flea And Tick Control, Vaccinations, And Convenience 38:59

• Jeff Grognet Recommends Essential Oils for Flea and Tick Treatment and Recommends the "Become Your Own Vet" Course for Alternative Veterinary Care.
• Rob Ryan Acknowledges the Value of Convenience But Cautions Against Compromising Pet Health for Convenience. There May Be a Limit to What People Can Endure for Their Pets' Well-Being.
• In Parksville, BC, Dr. Jeff Grognet Explains the Difficulty of Controlling Allergies and Diet.
• Jeff Grognet Addresses Vaccination Regulations in Canada, Highlighting Regional Variations.

Vaccine Schedules And Immunity In Veterinary Care 45:58

• A Veterinarian Discusses the Pros and Cons of Annual and Three-Year Vaccinations for Cats.
• Veterinarians Worry About Corporate Influence Resulting in Uniform Methods and Limited Options for Pet Owners.
• Jeff Grognet Recommends an Immune-Boosting Diet for Dogs, Citing the Capacity to Distinguish Between Different Diets Based on Coat Health.
• For Dog Immunity, Dr. Jeff Grognet Suggests a Combination of Vaccinations and a Nutritious Diet.

Dog Nutrition And Fasting 52:39

• Rob Ryan Observes the Impact of Canine Nutrition on Their Health by Weighing Dog Waste During Walks.
• Rob Ryan Fasts Once a Week and Feeds His Dog 2 Pounds of Raw Meat Daily to Cleanse the Gut.

Dog Nutrition And Digestive Health 56:23

• Rob Ryan Seeks Dr. Jeff Grognet's Advice On His Dog's Waste Disposal.
• According To Dr. Jeff Grognet, Rob Ryan's Dog's Meal, Which Comprises Water And Less Than Ideal Nutritional Content, Has A Low Digestion Rate, Leading To Large, Odorous Stools.
• Jeff Grognet Mentions a Medication for Anal Gland Issues That Includes a Heavy-Duty Fiber Supplement.
• To Address Anal Gland Issues In Dogs, Dr. Jeff Grognet Recommends Increasing Bone Intake In Their Diet.
• Jeff Grognet Explains Their Dog's Unusual Allergies And The Difficulty Of Finding Suitable Chew Toys.

Dog Health And Longevity With A Holistic Vet 1:03:00

• Rob Ryan Discusses the Shift in Society's View on Dogs, with More People Taking Better Care of Them.
• Jeff Grognet Discusses the History of Dog Ownership, Including the End of Free Roaming and the Growth of Holistic Pet Care.
• According to Dr. Jeff Grognet, Lean Dogs Live 13.2 Years Longer Than Non-Lean Dogs.
• Ragnar Recommends Consulting Holistic Vets for Important Insights and Recommendations.

Education And Holistic Health With Dr. Jeff Grognet 0:02

Rob Ryan  00:02

Hey, everybody, I'm so happy to be with you today and bring Dr. Jeff Grognet. As he put it, it's like a frog net, but Grognet.

Rob Ryan  00:12

So Jeff, welcome to our show on Gussy's Gut.

Dr. Jeff Grognet, 00:14

Thank you very much, Rob; I am glad to be here.

Rob Ryan  00:18

Well, it's adorable to sit here and chat with you. And I want to know, actually, a bunch of things about you. But just for everybody. Super quick, let's do a short rundown on who you are and what your practice is like, and then we'll take it off from there.

Dr. Jeff Grognet, 00:37

Okay. Yeah. My name is Jeff or Dr. Jeff; if you want to get formal, that's how I do it. And I've been a missionary for 40 years. And all that time I've been teaching, I started with first aid, then missionary assistance. I put through a fantastic number now, 42,000 students, but the key is, because of this education thing. I sold the practice two years ago, and now I'm utterly bored with education, but it's full bore holistic education because that's what I've been doing for the last 20 years in practice. And so that's what I'm doing. You can find me on the Internet, and I'm sure you'll tell people of all that, Rob.

Holistic Vet Medicine And Vaccine Longevity 1:24

Dr. Jeff Grognet, 01:24

But I'm trying to get people to adopt holistic ways. And that is feeding vaccines, toxins, treatments, whatever. And I do that through education on my site.

Rob Ryan  01:41

Right. Okay. Dr. Jeff's website is up on the screen at NewEarthvet.com. And there's an ebook there; scroll to the bottom of his homepage; you could download a free ebook, right?

Dr. Jeff Grognet  01:57

Yeah, it's called a holistic guidebook. It gives you an idea of what my thinking is, but you also probably realize that, hey, I can do some of this stuff. That's less, therefore. That's great.

Rob Ryan  02:10

I have a particular interest in it personally. So, just a personal privilege, here is the education you're doing. We're at a unique time where we have more and more demand for holistic, natural modalities, and we have a shortage of all vets and a real shortage of holistic vets. So, how are you? I know you've been super involved. You just mentioned how involved you are with education and educating professionals. How do you see addressing the future of holistic? How do you see holistic vet medicine in general? And how do you see addressing the shortage of it?

Dr. Jeff Grognet  03:04

Yeah, holistic vet medicine is going to have a significant impact on being able to satisfy veterinary needs. Because what's happening right now is that if I call up a veterinarian and I want to get my dog in, they're going to say, Hey, yeah, sure you can; we've got a month-long waiting list or something like that. And it's, and it's just a, I call it a crime. When I started, people could find the hospital and say, Hey, can I get in? Sure. Two o'clock this afternoon. We're on our way. And that's gone is wholly gone. And a lot of it is that there are insufficient veterinarians to meet the demand. Lots and lots more people have pets. And the last thing we'll say is that the vets are slacking off. They're busting their butts, trying to keep up with something. Yeah. But also, they're keeping up conventionally. And here and here's the thing, what we'll talk about today, Rob, and that is, right now, veterinarians are sending out reminders for either every year or every three-year vaccines conventionally. This means that if you've got a dog, you're going in every year or every three years to get in there and get them checked out, get them vaccinated, and then get back home. And things are changing. It's even changed for humans like me, which is ten years ago, and I don't know if you're as old as I am. I'm going to say that. So the point is ten years ago, my doctor told me that it's a good idea to see every year. Stick your finger up the bum and do a PSA test. This was general stuff you did yearly because they're in that prevention mode. And now you, the annual examiner in human medicine, have gone as in there unless you're on prescriptions. But the point is, they're not calling us in to get checked regularly. And so that's one side. The other side is about the whole vaccine issue. The reason people are going in is that they get that card in the mail that says Fluffy or Rover is due for vaccines because they have an expired quote. And they don't. And the point is that dog vaccines we know last for at least nine years. And actually, they last a lifetime. And so, why do we keep going back? And so if we can change our thinking to follow these vaccine ideas, then what's going to happen is that our actual veterinary demand is going to go down. I could solve the veterinary crisis within a year by doing that. But it takes a whole mindset change to be able to do that. But that's the way we had it in our practice. We did not have them coming in every year. Yep. So we're doing what a visionary is supposed to do. We're dealing with sickies.

Rob Ryan  06:13

But are the nine years that you brought up? Did the vaccines last? Are you are you referring to the challenge? The study?

Dr. Jeff Grognet  06:24

No, the challenge study you're talking about was the rabies challenge study. And that ended before they could prove that seven years was allowable? Yeah, they did a five-year test, and they said, Hey, this is suitable for five years; we know we're doing great. And then when it came down to testing it for the seven-year things that two years later, they couldn't sound crazy, but they couldn't get any rabies virus to try the animals. So they had to terminate it. And so that, unfortunately, finished right there. And because of the cost of it, you're not going to see companies doing a repeat of that, which is just impossible. No, the nine years come from the guidelines set up initially by the American Animal Hospital Association. The World Small Animal Veterinary Association adopted the same thing. And what they think is this is the conundrum in their guidelines. What the guidelines state is that we shouldn't be doing vaccines any more often than every three years. Okay. Okay. The thing that most veterinarians don't read is The any more often them because they say, oh, we should be doing them every three years. So then in this small print beside that, it said, we know that Parvo and distemper, so we're talking core vaccines only Parvo and distemper lasts for nine years, comma, and possibly a lifetime. Okay, in cats, it's seven years for the core vaccines. Okay, so that brings the felines in there for you. And so, based on that, we can do the puppy vaccines. And then if we follow that number, we can say, okay, we're doing nine years. Now. Wow. Okay. But there are other titer methods, and you're doing a titer test. That's what we did in our practice. And that is we can extend it and say, Hey, no, we're good. We're good, period.

Rob Ryan  08:38

at the nine-year mark even tighter and then decide if you need it.

Dr. Jeff Grognet  08:42

No, it's a different method. So I'll go over that for you. Titers can be used in two ways. One way, which is the most common way that veterinarians use it, is that they will say Oh, Rover's due for vaccines this year.

Vaccine Immunity And Titer Testing In Dogs 8:57

Dr. Jeff Grognet  08:57

And so rather than that, let's do a titer and see if he needs the vaccine. So what they did is they did a titer to measure the immunity, and that is they're checking the antibody level to either distemper, Parvo. Okay, so a titer tells you, are there antibodies in the bloodstream? Okay. Now, the way that I was working with this and it, and when I say we, the practice that we had was me and also my wife, who's a veterinarian. Okay, so that's, that's the royal week, and very justified me. And so, what we did was that we got them in, and we did one vaccine when they were 16 weeks old. The reason we did that is to make sure we weren't in a time where maternal antibodies could interfere with the vaccination process. Still, more say the immunization process, we wanted to ensure they responded to the vaccine. And then, a month later, we do a titer. Yep. So, the point of that titer is to find out if that dog became immunized. Did that dog respond to the vaccine? Yep. Now, the kicker is when you and I were little guys. I got vaccines for measles. I got polio. I got those vaccines. How many boosters have you had? Since you were that young, Rob?

Rob Ryan  10:27

I don't think any. Bingo.

Dr. Jeff Grognet  10:29

Yeah. And why is that because immunity lasts for a lifetime? For the viral vaccines, okay. Put it down to those guys. And so because of that, we get vaccinated as kids, and we don't get vaccinated again. Yeah. And there's this whole concept called memory. Yep. And so what happens is, if I vaccinate a puppy at 16 weeks old when I inject the vaccine, the puppy reacts, and the way they react is they produce antibodies. The antibodies are produced by what we call B lymphocytes. They're the little, little, little, tiny, tiny guys, but their job is to produce antibodies specific to that book. And they do that to every other bug in the body—every other one, okay? But the point is, we've now generated a clone of B lymphocytes, and their sole job is to produce antibodies to distemper, for example. Okay. So they produce antibodies, and then we do a blood test and say, Hey, we woke them up, they're working, they're on track; we know they exist. Okay. Now, every immunology text in the world will tell you that memory cells last for a lifetime with the animal, and the host will. So we've proven they exist at some point, usually if the animal lives long enough, and it probably will; in our case, it is very accurate because of our ages, because we can live to 90. Eventually, the antibody level starts to go down. It always does. Okay, but this is the key: it often doesn't get to zero, but it may get to the point where it's undetectable. Therefore, the conventional veterinarian will say, oh, it is below that threshold; we need to vaccinate. But if we've done the titer already, what that means is that we know the immune systems are on board, and we know there's memory going on. So, we do not need to do another titer in that dog's lifetime. Because if it's negative or positive, we're still going to make the same assumption that no, the cells are there, they're ready to go into action that if the disease came along, that's they would react as well as what's called an animistic response. It's a big fancy name for it. But it means they were there dormant, and then they blew out and attacked it. So, that's the key.

Interestingly, I did a talk on this, and they had three other veterinarians in the discussion with me, and they're all of my chronological gender. And I said, How many times have you seen a dog out of puppyhood that's been vaccinated die from that disease, no matter how many vaccines it's had or not, and the answer was zero? So, if they go through a successful puppy series, they are protected. I was told that when I was in vet school, the veterinarian who taught us immunology there said specifically that parvovirus is such a great virus that it creates full-blown lifelong immunity either with vaccination or with the disease itself. So that was Knology. Prof. may allow the small animal internal professor to say, Oh, yeah, don't forget to vaccinate every year.

Rob Ryan  14:09

Wow. So, a couple of things from the everyday consumer point of view: who's watching this? Number one? What is your opinion on this? Why not keep a schedule every three years? What's the harm? What's the problem? If it's a matter of cost, my insurance can cover it. Why wouldn't I ensure they're protected and not leave anything to chance? Let's answer that question for you.

Vaccine Safety And Efficacy In Dogs 14:47

Dr. Jeff Grognet  14:47

Some people liked that argument. And also, some people like buying lots of insurance for dogs and cats. Right, and that is, if you pay enough for the insurance, it will pay for everything. Yeah, and you'll be paying extra because the veterinarian is getting the same fees, but you're paying more because of the insurance companies in there. But the point is that when you hear about vaccines, the terms you keep hearing repeatedly are efficacious. And safe. Those are the two buzzwords surrounding vaccines. It is safe and effective. Yep. Yep, safe and effective. The problem with those two words is that, first off, they are effective when you're dealing with the core vaccines, so the distemper Parvo is adequate; there's no doubt about that. When dealing with the ones for the noncore vaccines of leptospirosis, Lyme disease, and canine influenza, those are Bordetella. They're not 100% sure they can still get the disease. And so and so there's much controversy on that, especially when you're talking about leptospirosis. That's the kingpin of this one. But the other side is when you've got the other worry: are they safe? And indeed, with vaccines, you can see the obvious. And that is the most obvious thing: you inject a vaccine into a dog. And boom, it can. I call it the kid who gets the peanut with a full-blown allergy.

Rob Ryan  16:32

Yep.

Dr. Jeff Grognet  16:34

Right. Believe it or not, I've never seen that in a dog or cat. Okay, but I know veterinarians are deaf; they accidentally kill an animal, and within 15 minutes, holy moly, we got a problem here, you know. They're putting on IV fluids, giving them adrenaline, and pulling them through. The more common thing is that you retake and bring your dog home. And then you'll notice half an hour later, an hour later, the muscles swelling up. And that's what I call it; that's where you have a dashhound trying to look like a sharp pay, right? Their muscles are blowing up, their eyelids are blowing up, and their ears are getting thicker. I mean, it's just, but this is a good point. They've already passed the point where they can die from this because they do not have a complete anaphylactic reaction. They're having a delayed response.

Rob Ryan  17:29

This is the good news. That's

Dr. Jeff Grognet  17:31

The good news. Okay. The bad news. Is this telling us the dogs are reacting? Yep. Do we want to test the dog next time? To see if it can serve as anything worse, I would avoid that like the plague. But the other side with all this is that vaccines, from the holistic standpoint, are tied in with a lot of other diseases. Indeed, we can see this in the scientific literature beautifully. We can see inflammation in bone, and we can see what's called hypertrophic osteodystrophy, where we vaccinate puppies, especially with bailout vaccines, the one of leptospirosis and all that stuff, and all of a sudden their joints are just swelling up. Okay, so they're in much pain, and it can cause long-term disfigurement. So there's, there's that one that's quite obvious. There's hemolytic anemia. And what happens in that one is that the body's immune system reacts to the red blood cells in the bloodstream. And it destroys them. So many, but they can become an EMIC. Oh, and this is where the dichotomy comes in.

Conventional veterinarians generally will say, well, vaccines have nothing to do with that because it doesn't occur at that time. However, studies show that many occur within a month of vaccination. That's one side. Another thing is this exciting fact: if you read about hemolytic anemia in veterinary textbooks, it says there are no vaccination dogs that have had hemolytic anemia in case it triggers another event. So it's there. But we, but it's ignored, correct? But so definitely, there's something there. But the other side of that is that we're looking at the chronic issues of over-vaccination. In cats, we know the injections can cause tumor formation. Yep. That's the biggie. And then what's the leading cause of death in dogs is cancer. Yeah. Okay. So, we see lots of that compared to when I first started practicing. I am seeing so many more cancer tumors and such, and some breeds are just devastated by that. So, I mean a golden retriever, which used to be a herding breed. Now, if they pass nine years old, it's like, all right. Wow. Bernese Mountain dogs, a ten-year-old burner. Almost unheard of. Wow.

Dr. Jeff Grognet  20:17

And so, cancers are more common than the others if you think of vaccines as stimulating the immune system. Is that the reason why we're seeing so many dogs with allergies these days? Okay, and that's a tenuous one. But holistic practitioners are entirely on board with that saying—yeah, we've got to try to get the vaccines down. So you don't see all this cancer stuff going on? Yeah,

Rob Ryan  20:45

yeah. What? What is it you think that so if you have all these dogs that are presumably getting similar vaccine schedules but Golden's are having a rougher time of it? So, are Bernese Mountain dogs at what? What do you think that is? It's just genetics.

Dr. Jeff Grognet  21:05

It's a lot. Yeah, there's got to be a genetic component. Then, when I graduated, I was told that the breed problem to capture was the boxer. Yeah. Okay. And that is if you see a lump on a fighter, assumed terrible news from the get-go. Okay. But that was the only breed that was singled out. Yeah. And that was in 1983. Okay, the world has changed. Now, a lot of it is because of, and I wouldn't say I like to use the word inbreeding, but I'll call it popularity breeding. And that is, Golden's are a great example.

There's one particular male who fathered an incredible number of offspring. Yep. And then it turned out that, guess what, he had inherited its effect in his jams. Yeah. Boom, down the road. We're seeing this disease all over. Now. So, if you think of it from the cancer perspective, yeah, we can have the same problem. And that is, we're just getting these teams concentrated in this limited gene pool. And unfortunately, if one, if one dog does so well, then especially a male, they're going to be sucking the seam out of that guy and going like crazy. Wow.

Vaccine Reactions And Allergies In Dogs 22:29

Rob Ryan  22:29

Wow. So, going back to something you said earlier, the dog that reacts doesn't have anaphylactic shock. But Sharpay looks like a sharp pain. And looks like a short. But you said something like that? Would you test them later? No. Did you? Did you mean, like, titer? Testing? Why wouldn't you try to download it?

Dr. Jeff Grognet  22:52

Would you test them next year by giving the same vaccine? Oh, yeah, no. Okay. That's what I meant. Yeah. That is that, oh, we gave this vaccine, the face swelled up. And, and then this is the kicker from the conventional side, though, some veterinarians will be saying, well, all we got to do is give them a dose of Benadryl 20 minutes before, and then we can provide the vaccine, and we're safe. Yeah. If we're having to go through that hurdle. And even thinking we want to put this dog's life on the line. Yeah. Why are we giving a vaccine? That's not necessary?

Rob Ryan  23:31

Yeah. Or why are we giving anything that's not necessary? Yes.

Dr. Jeff Grognet  23:35

Anything at all? Yeah. That's for sure.

Rob Ryan  23:40

Sure. That is a fair enough question. So do you think that when I've had when I've talked to veterinarians about the different things that make the back, as I understand it, the vaccines work and cause a reaction, so that in the body that let's use the dog, for example, the dog's body says, Oh, let me take note of this and let me cause a reaction and get the desired effect, which is an immune response? Whether that's an adjuvant or something else. Do you think the same thing happens? Hypothetically, you go to the vet's office, and you get this multi. What do you call Valence? Yeah, yeah, definitely Valence, which is 234 and an in one shot, or seven or eight. Yeah, oh, god forbid, yeah. Seven. So all of that is going in at one time, the body deals with that rush of immediate, it's a threat and comes to the dog's aid. But then the dog goes and steps on the grass. And that reaction, everything in that dog's world, is reactive. Is that the cause of, like, just as an example, a grass allergy? In some dogs? Could that do it?

Dr. Jeff Grognet  25:17

You don't need the timing of such as you were applying. It simply is that if you're messing around with the immune system, yep. And, and vaccines, and you can read stuff that goes both ways here because we know that parvovirus vaccines tend to suppress the immune system temporarily. Okay. Conversely, giving any vaccine creates a response in the immune system, so it becomes overactive. Yeah, so what from, and this is, this is well known if you have a dog that has allergies, and you vaccinate during their allergy time. So, in other words, if you've got a dog that has seasonal allergies that go from August till October every year, which is the grass season, tight, everyone, and you vaccinate them at the beginning of September, you're going to make that worse, and it's going to last longer. Oh, okay. And so quite often, if we had to do any vaccines, and there we're talking more, say the rabies, which is legally required in some places. In those cases, we'd like to say, " Okay, it's due in September, but we know there's a problem. Why don't we shift it to next February, in the middle of winter? And try and do it that way. In terms of being related to allergies, your idea is excellent, Rob, and that is, you've created a hyper-sensitized immune system. The things that dogs get allergic to are the things that they are exposed to every day. Okay, so if they're fed food that has corn and chicken in it, guess what? That's what they can react to if they're going out on going through grass. Bingo. Yeah, that can be an IT. My dog has allergies.

Dog Allergies, Vaccines, And Parasiticides 27:17

Dr. Jeff Grognet  27:17

And he's a novice. He's named Shay as a six-year-old Border Collie cross guy. But he has food allergies. So we're very specific on what he gets. He has his feoff. And his main meat is Lamma. That's the one that taught me he tolerates the best. He can also have venison and kangaroo. So we're talking exotic stuff. Okay. If you waggle chicken in front of his nose, he'll get diarrhea. Yeah. And he'll get itchy. Yeah. Okay. So he's got a food allergy. He also has environmental allergies. So if I take him out on a July day, and he runs through grassy fields, I don't do anything else with him as I bring him home. I've got a dog that's scratching all night. Okay. So what I do is if I'm going to grass fields, I make sure I go down to the river right after. And before we get into the car, and I throw him, he's got a clung on a rope, I throw it in the river, do that three or four times, rinse them off really could. And that solves the problem. He only had one vaccine. So the point is he came across his allergies, honestly. Yeah. And that is, he got them from his mother. And his siblings have it, too. Yeah. So, there are genetic components to all that, but we can have a genetic predisposition. But we can then change things to make the diseases come out. And you're familiar with certain foods that will create certain conditions in the same way that vaccines can trigger certain things as well. Wow. Yeah, not every dog will get hemolytic anemia, but the select one will Yeah.

Rob Ryan  29:13

You said your dog got his vaccines, honestly. What do you mean by that?

Dr. Jeff Grognet  29:20

No, he got his allergies, honestly. Oh, honestly. Okay.

Rob Ryan  29:24

I thought what I heard you say was through his mom the that the immunity through his mom, but you meant the allergies. Okay. Yeah, the allergy and its review. That's very interesting. Honestly, that's funny. So, talk to me about what's in your ebook on your website. What are you teaching people about that?

Dr. Jeff Grognet  29:48

One of the things, of course, is the vaccination idea. And that is what I call the one-and-done, and that is with puppies. We do the one vaccine at 16 weeks. We do. We're tighter, and then we've done it. But I also addressed what to do with the noncore vaccines, as in what makes sense in that world. The other topics in their minds. There's a fair bit, but the main two other topics are food. And that is certainly going over. And if anyone's watching this, I'm sure they're already geared to this. And that is the perils of some of the commercial foods as in what we're trying to avoid there in terms of them nutritionally, and toxins and things like that. And then what type of foods can we suggest? And, I'm not someone who says, hey, you've got to feed raw, I'm going distill feed commercially. And let's call them a homemade raw something where you can identify the ingredients you're putting into it. Sure. Okay. And I'm talking about cats and dogs in this case, and I've got recipes for that. But that's the key. Being able to create a food that you can, similar to us if you can, you can be named what you're eating at supper time, rather than coming out in this matching if we were eating cereals that were kept this round Brown, and we didn't know what was in it. Yep, that'd be scary, too. Right? Sure. Of course. Yeah. So that's the biggie, and then the other one is getting into a call the parasiticide. So, that is the chemicals we use for pest control. And there's certainly a focus now on some of the newer insecticides. And there we're talking specifically about flea preventatives, tick preventives, heartworm preventives, that type of thing. And there's, for example, and I always like picking on bravecto because it's the biggest seller where I am. And I've seen some cases of dogs that get toxic from it. And they will never dispense it from our hospital. So this, this dog, I remember one came from, I call it elsewhere about the hospital. And he came in, and the muscles it when he saw its legs, it was throughout, and they're just vibrating, right? And it's like God, this guy, and it wasn't quitting. It's like, what is going on? It's like we're thinking about having a seizure, but we never quite got there. Well. And, yeah, it had proven two days before. And so one of the things that I always talk about when we're looking at these insecticides is that we're giving them regularly. Let's imagine we're going to do a graph right here. We provide a tablet right here, okay, and that's bravecto. Pill, my buddy, because this can apply to any of these. Okay, please give me a medicine here, and the blood level goes up, and it starts to come down. Does it ever get to zero? Well, no, because it comes down and gets to the point where it's ineffective. It's not killing the fleas as fast as it should. Sure. So it's come down to this level, and then we get another tablet right here, which goes straight back up, and then it starts coming down again. So we never get down to the zero mark. And I asked the company specifically that makes directors, and I asked him, What blood levels do you get down to? They couldn't tell me they never tested that. All the test was whether or not it killed the fleece. Yeah. So, the way I always talk to people about that little fact is this. You now have a two-year-old daughter or granddaughter. Pick the age you want. And then we can stop her from getting lice from people she's going to daycare with. Yep. All you have to do is give this one tablet every three months, and it'll make sure that she never gets lice ever again. All besides that, it's an innocent insecticide, and it may cause her to have seizures. Do you want the prescription? Yeah.

Pet Flea And Tick Treatments And Their Potential Risks 34:17

Dr. Jeff Grognet  34:17

Okay, because I consider dogs and cats similar to your two-year-old. Yeah. Okay, we're responsible for what they're eating, what they're being given, everything. Well,

Rob Ryan  34:30

I'm mainly talking about these pills. I'm also particularly concerned not only for dogs but for my safety on these drops when you touch them. Oh, yeah, you pet a dog, and you get that on you. I mean, I don't want to be treated for fleas. I mean, I've never put that stuff on my dogs. But if that's your decision, but I almost feel like if you're at a dog, for example, or how can you, you adore on a dog see a dog in the store or something, there could be a disclaimer on these dogs when they have these treatments on them. For human safety, let alone kids coming up and petting dogs. It's like, oh, yeah,

Dr. Jeff Grognet  35:22

Yeah, the, the, the, when you read the product inserts, and specifically, the one that I remember is Advantage Music. It says, Allow to dry for two hours before petting, hugging, and whatever. Okay, so that it will be absorbed into the fat on the skin, and it will stay there. And you're not going to get it on your hands, technically. But there was a case, and I'm going back about 30 years here. And it was one of the topicals that was used. And a woman went to the vet hospital and had all her dogs treated. And then she was driving home. And the fumes from it overcame her, and she had a car accident. She had a Volkswagen Beetle with three St. Bernard's, and it's Whoa, but the point is, you can imagine how much was put on the dogs. And then it was in that enclosed space in she was overcome with that, which was like, wow, that's hard to believe, so. So the point is, yes, they can affect the old stuff we robbed when you return to the 1980s. When I graduated, we didn't have ivantage, which had yet to be invented. Yeah. Well, at that point, we had fleas, sprays, collars, and impellers. Okay, but I mean, if you remember it, those flea sprays. I mean, if you sprayed them on, you'd almost choke with those guys. I don't know the dogs and cats ever, Chilcott.

Rob Ryan  37:06

Yeah, as a kid, we used this. We had the Husky Collie mixes, and they got flies all the time they lived in the backyard; they weren't indoor dogs, and we would spray them with a product called flies off. Yeah. And that stuff was like, I remember going, when I was spraying it, like, and it just so funny, when you don't know anything back, then you do something you think is suitable for these dogs? Jeff, what will we do about our need to have everything convenient and pay a severe price on the back end? That's invisible. It's all of this is about convenience. And there's only a little thought you need to put into it. You. You do it once a day, once a week, once a month, once a year, whatever the thing is, isn't that the issue? What are we going to do about this? no,

Dr. Jeff Grognet  38:10

I think you're you're; you said it but glossed over it quickly. And that is back in those days we did that. And we didn't think there was any problem. Yeah. We're looking, I'm looking back at the beginning of my career going, I can't believe we had a fleet spray called flicks. And it was like God, I mean, it was just a horrible point. It only lasted for a day. So you had to put it on daily if you wanted to work. And now we look back at that and think, Oh, that was so toxic. And another 2040 years, whatever it will be, we'll look at today and say cheese. We're putting that stuff on our dogs and cats and going. Let me see you, amazingly. Did they make it through? Yeah, we're going to be looking at that.

Flea And Tick Control, Vaccinations, And Convenience 38:59

Dr. Jeff Grognet  38:59

And if we get more of an adoption of the list of ideas, it will go much faster. Yeah. And there are alternatives. And that is, you can use essential oils for working with fleas and ticks and such. There's stuff available online, but you can also make it yourself. Yeah, that's one of my courses; it will be called Become Your Vet. And we don't give you vet credentials. But the point is that this is in part because you can only get to see veterinarians slowly, and most of them are conventional. It's a way for you to treat and identify and treat things yourself. Yeah. And one of the things in there is how to get you know how to treat the fleas. What can you use to treat these guys? And it's there's there's lots of options that way, but many people, as you say, Don't go that route because I've got to remember to do that. It's inconvenient. It's a bit messier. Yeah, some of those things. Meanwhile, it's a credit. At least it's safer. And you can give one dose of the new flea products, and I'm talking bravecto Next Guards in America; there are probably a few more others in there that I've mentioned. And there's no evidence that you can give one dose and turn a dog into a person with epilepsy who needs to be treated for life. Oh. So when will we start saying that, hey, if convenience is excellent, but we've got to back off on this idea? Yeah, I'm totally, totally with you on that, Rob.

Rob Ryan  40:32

Well, some people will always take calculated risks, and convenience is the most important thing. And many people will want to avoid dealing with fleas in their homes. And, we see with this drug cutpoint, for example, the big thing with dog imaging is what it's keeping, it's keeping these people up at night. This dog is affecting their sleep; they love the dog, but they have to get rest. And that's also that convenience thing. And there's, they don't see another way around it. And part of that is they need to have the right resources in front of them. But yeah, the other part is that there's a limit to what they will tolerate very much.

Dr. Jeff Grognet  41:28

Very much. So. Yeah. But in the case of allergy control, the two drugs that are up there are Apple Quell and the cytopoint. Yeah, and if you read the drug insert on Apple Quell, one of the one of the things that can cause cancer. Yep. So, if we would, would I take that medication myself? I always look at it that way. Right. And so, so that's one side, but people have to decide where their breakpoint is. And to come back to food for a second. Yeah. For some people, the breakpoint is that, well, if I can't pull it out of the bag, it is too much for me. Yeah. Okay, to make Shea's food every day, I buy it frozen in packages and do it that way. So, to make his food, he takes it out of the fridge, puts it in the sink, puts warm water on it, and waits, sometimes taking 15 minutes. They take it out, and I put the supplements in it, and bingo, that's that food. But that assumes 15 minutes of, quote, time to go from the freezer to his mouth. Yeah. Right. And some people's lives don't have that. Yeah. And I appreciate that. It's what it does. It does happen, but the problem is there. Also, if they're that strapped on time, they're probably not making good meals for themselves, either. Yeah, yeah. So it depends on what we want to do for ourselves nutritionally, and, meaning, what drugs do we use and such? Yeah, yeah.

Rob Ryan  43:17

If you're located where?

Dr. Jeff Grognet  43:22

I mean, Canada, British Columbia. And so I hide in a place called Parksville.

Rob Ryan  43:29

Do you hide in place parks? Where's Parksville? Where's that approximately, but

Dr. Jeff Grognet  43:33

It's some Vancouver Island. This is off the coast of British Columbia, and I'm about halfway up on the right side.

Rob Ryan  43:43

Or you write it I said Poor you. That's a beautiful area.

Dr. Jeff Grognet  43:49

It is a beautiful area. I'm looking out at the ocean here with the islands behind. It's all right.

Rob Ryan  43:53

at all. No, no. BC is one of my favorite places ever. So, what do they do in Canada with vaccinations? Are they required every three years or one year? What?

Dr. Jeff Grognet  44:09

Well, in terms of they, it depends on who you're talking about. Because they are assuming you're talking to the veterinarian, know the government, the government. Oh, the government where I live,

Rob Ryan  44:22

where they require, yes, zero. Okay, zero.

Dr. Jeff Grognet  44:25

There are some areas of Canada, mainly Eastern Glycol eastern Canada, that's Ontario and such, where local municipalities will require rabies vaccines, okay. Okay. Where I live, there's no such requirement. We don't have rabies here except in the baths occasionally. However, we're in places in Ikan, Ontario, where they require rabies. That's where which one the person gets for their animals is going to be based on the vaccine that that veterinarian, as with dogs. Generally, they're all three-year vaccines in an adult dog; you get one done as a puppy, you get one done a year later, and then it's good every three years from another is what you're doing. And they usually say this: you follow the manufacturer's guidelines on how long it lasts. In cat land, there are both one-year and three-year vaccines available. And then the one year he mentioned the big fancy word, originally, adjuvants, the three-year vaccines that adjuvants, so therefore, we know that protection lasts for three years. But what they were worried about is that adjuvants could be triggering the tumors that we see in cats called feline fibrosarcoma. And so there was an enterprising vaccine company that said, Hey, we've got one that's more purified. But it only lasts for one year.

Dr. Jeff Grognet  45:57

Okay.

Vaccine Schedules And Immunity In Veterinary Care 45:58

Dr. Jeff Grognet  45:58

What we know now is, and this is from studies, is that taking out the adjuvant or not doesn't have any bearing on the incidence of the tumors. Okay. So what happens then, of course, this what we're doing annually, we're giving three times as many vaccines to keep them current, okay, which means we're exposing them to it. And it's the injection of anything in caps that can create the tumor predisposition. Let's stick with the three-year vaccine, everyone, but the other side is, let's try and reduce all the vaccines as much as possible. So we don't have this chance of developing those in cats.

Rob Ryan  46:43

Okay. Yeah. Well, it's everything has trade-offs.

Dr. Jeff Grognet  46:51

It very definitely does. Yeah, yeah. There. Yeah. Unfortunately, there's, there's, and there's been a trend, and that is, when I graduated, we were told as students and then as a veterinarian that, hey, you vaccinated every year because the code the immunity wears out? Well, that was wrong. We now know that that does not happen. And then, in 1995, the first guidelines came out for three years. And so that is why many vets adopted that. But those are still around 40%. That's still vaccinated annually. Yeah. Why? The last time they read anything since then since they graduated. But we have, we're also seeing a resurgence. And that is, as we get more of the practices being taken over by corporate structures, they're dictating what the vaccine schedule will be. And they're moving back to a one-year program as well.

Rob Ryan  47:54

Wow, surprise. Yeah. Yeah. So.

Dr. Jeff Grognet  47:57

So here's where that's where the problem lies. And that is if we keep pushing this thing to a one year, which means everyone's going to be taking all those dogs and cats in on an annual basis, we're going to have to miss getting to see the vet for an AI problem.

Rob Ryan  48:12

Yeah. Well, do you do you see the future of veterinary practices? It is likely to be in trouble when it comes to a company whose name does not need to be mentioned, but it owns the entire cycle from food to ensure it holds a piece of a company that only knows about it partially. Yeah, food insurance is proper medical practice. In some cases, even the companies that put them to sleep and euthanize them do not euthanize them. But cremation. Yeah. Cremation. So you're getting to the end. Do you think that is problematic to you? For better?

Dr. Jeff Grognet  49:14

Is there any infiltration in that called integrative management? Yeah, that's because what we're seeing is precisely that problem. And that is, the veterinarians who are working under that umbrella are suggesting the foods that that company makes, so they're funneling everything in, which means that dogs and cats are being placed into a cutting-edge veterinary operation. Yeah. Okay. And this is blatantly obvious. There was one case I had because I had a lot of students. I see this all the time, and that is those Say, Yeah, I've got an indoor cat, and I just got all these vaccines for it. And I'm going, okay, so your indoor must mean that you don't have any screens on the windows and, or anything like that. And notice all screen, and we're on the, we're on the 12th floor of an apartment building and says, Well, there's no risk. So why are we getting the vaccines, and then then it starts to all come up? They've also deflated the worm into all this other stuff. It's like, we don't have any risk here, everyone, so you have to look at the individual animal. That way, we can make logical decisions on health care. It's like having a 16-year-old dog with a wart on its nose. And you're going, Yep, yeah, we better book surgery on that guy. Yeah. Hold it. Hold it. Can he die with that word? Yeah, let's, let's go that route. It's

Rob Ryan  50:59

yeah, yeah. So, how do you deal with immunity? Other than vaccines? What do you recommend to shore up resilience?

Dr. Jeff Grognet  51:15

The main thing I'm not, as you've probably gathered, is that I'm not anti-vaccine. I'm saying yes. Get the initial ones and the core vaccines that will be good for life. In terms of the other ones, though, yes, keeping the immunity up is the best way. And the way to do that is there are two approaches: feeding the proper diet. And I'm sure you're all behind that, Rob, and that is, hey, this isn't a dog; what type of food should this dog eat logically appropriate? Let's work on that first. And that is, let's get the right food going into the dog's mouth. That way, we can keep them as healthy as they can. And when you look at dogs that are fed up, I could do this very quickly if someone brought a dog and put them on the table. And then I went into that room. A minute or three minutes later, just by going in the room and smelling, I could tell what type of food that dog was on. Wow. Okay. And then then all I had to do was to go over part, the hair coat. And you go, Oh, look at all this scarf, dandruff and stuff. And the other side is you get your hand on the hair coat. And you rub back and forth. And you go. Yeah, that's Purina, right?

Dog Nutrition And Fasting 52:39

Rob Ryan  52:39

It's like you're a Somali a of dog food. Smells. Yeah.

Dr. Jeff Grognet  52:43

But you could do it. I used to. Back in, going 20 years ago, when I ran a marathon as I was training all that time. But there was a dog I saw just down the hill from me. And it's a Rottweiler. And he always came out. So aggressive, runner, it's ready to kill me. And it's like, his name was Butch. And I said, Butch Get your ass over here, and I give him a bump, scrub, you know? And most of the time, especially in the winter, I wore gloves. And then it's like, oh, and that was, that was my Purina dog. Right. I knew what they fed him. It was cheap, cheap stuff, and his haircut looked horrible, right? And so the point is, if you're going to be feeding them a commercial diet, especially a cheaper commercial diet, they're going to be deficient. Yeah. Which means their body is short and their immune system is deficient. Everything. Versus if you feed them the proper diet, and you can go raw, you can go with the home-cooked, but you know the ingredients in it. Hey, we then have a chance of actually getting an immune system that's capable of doing something. Yeah. So that's what we want to do there,

Rob Ryan  53:54

Do you know what I had? I noticed when I was out on a walk, and I saw a dog, a medium big dog, like a golden retriever, not a great game. I have picked up other dogs' poops along our dog walk because some people are at a dog bag or whatever the case is. And I'll notice how heavy these poops are. Yep. Physically heavy. And I want to hear something from you here. So, my dog Gus has always been rough at accepting me as a puppy. He had a mix of some stuff, but it's his whole life. He's been raw-fed a great diet. And I was taught by Ian Billinghurst. So there's that. And for every pound, let's use a pound of food I feed him. He eats two pounds of raw meat a day. He's as lean as can be. People think I need to provide him with more. He's, he's built like a coyote. He's a Labrador, and he just turned seven years old last week. And so if I feed him two pounds, I will bet you his because he fasts once a week. So, I always have one day a week where he only gets water or coconut water. I usually buy him coconut water. And that's how I get through the guilt of not feeling this.

Dr. Jeff Grognet  55:28

Big of you. Yes.

Rob Ryan  55:29

Well, I try. And it's also coconut water is impressive in its alkalinity, and it's a complete food, really, but the alkalinity pushes it to clean the colon right out. So I love it because the whole point of him fasting is not only not eating but also evacuating his colon, fully, I hope. And, then, it just gives the entire organ system arrest. Well. Back to this two-pound meal. I've done this for a long time. I've done I-fed RA for over 23 or four years now. I only pick up in the form of a poop, maybe about a quarter, depending on the health of the animal, the age of the animal, a quarter to a third of a pound of food. And I'm always fascinated.

Dog Nutrition And Digestive Health 56:23

Rob Ryan  56:23

Like, where does this go? Seriously, where does this go? I mean, what is this meat and bone in fat and all this stuff? Go, it's getting used up by the body. But it's not coming out like it's a; it's still a crazy mystery mystery mysterious to me in the most exciting way. So what's your answer to that? I love to hear that.

Dr. Jeff Grognet  56:46

From you. Oh, good. I thought you may be you're going to be asking me to go around smelling dog poop.

Rob Ryan  56:52

But no, no. Okay, although you're the guy, you're the veterinarian to do it. Okay.

Dr. Jeff Grognet  56:57

Don't spread that around. No. No, the, and this is the kicker. When I take my dog for a walk. And we go out on trails, and people take their dogs out. And in the first 300 feet, that's where all of them poop. Yes. Right. And so the key is with Shay; he's off his 45-pound dog. Okay, but it's smaller than your guy. But the poops he has, I mean, because I watch it very well, the big ones will be about an inch in diameter and about four inches long. That's two of those in a day. And that's it. Right? So So, there are two points. One is that the food that you're giving also contains water and less than what's coming out in the poop. So it's going to go down that way. But the other side, and this is the most essential part. And this is what differentiates Chase's poop from that other dog's poop. It's called digestibility. Yep, pure and simple. And so if that food you were giving that you're giving was 100%. Digestible? Yeah. That would mean there'd be no poop coming out from the food. Yeah. Okay. And so that tells you so, in other words, if you were to give him just a call sugar cubes, or something like that, there'll be nothing coming out of the back end. Right? It'd be dissolved and absorbed. And that's it. Okay. And then the flip side of that is if you feed your regular kibble that which is 50% carbs. That is all plant materials. So therefore, you're going to be producing large voluminous, smelly, usually soft-tissue stools. And, the point is that, yeah, it's all based on that being much less digestible than what she's getting. Right. And so, the, it's just what's left, that's, that's all it is. But the point is, there's so much about this being absorbed, utilized by the body as an as a, you can call it a chemical, but it's a nutrient. Yep. And it just gets used and then peed out.

Rob Ryan  59:17

Yeah, right.

Dr. Jeff Grognet  59:19

That's right.

Rob Ryan  59:21

It's a miracle. It's fantastic. And yeah, and then you've got many times you've got that you have this thing where my dog gets the bone, he grinds it up, and there's he has a very similar proof to your dog. But then at the end, it's this like, it's this I call a spent fuel rod. It's the bone that is dead. He pulled out all the good stuff from the bone, but it was all the trash of the bone. And yeah, and it's just, it just he doesn't need it body doesn't need it. It's it's all he's pulled everything out of it. He needs it, and I go, okay, well, you. There it is. That's also good. You see, it's perfect for this, for that this, it's beyond roughage, it's like this great cleaner through the colon, that, and also anal glands and all that fun stuff. So, many dogs that have these inner gland problems, I always the first thing I tell people, my friends, I'll say, Well, maybe look at the diet, and add some more bone to it—and, real clean food.

Dr. Jeff Grognet  1:00:34

Yeah, no, there's, there's a medical medication for anal sex issues. Yeah. And what it is is it's a heavy-duty fiber.

Rob Ryan  1:00:45

Yeah, I was going to say, there's, there's another medication, it's called good food.

Dr. Jeff Grognet  1:00:49

Yeah. And so it's like, I know another way of solving that issue. And it's called, let's bulk up the stool and make them make it work a little bit more. I'm bringing this in so people can understand this, however. The food that we get for Shea is, as I mentioned, very exotic in the protein department. Because of that, there is no bone in it. Yeah. Okay, as in, they sell it as the meat. And that's it. And so, I would love to give him a bone. Okay, and I've tried it over the years; I've given him a chicken, initially, it was chicken bones, and then moved into the beef bones, things like that. And unfortunately, his allergies are severe enough that he gets diarrhea with any of the bones that we try. And so we can't go to the pet store or get a llama bone in Canada; it just doesn't happen. And so because of that, we have to go, unfortunately, the nutritional supplement way. And then he gets his chewing on caught toys. And he does every night; he's chewing on the toys, and it works well, and his teeth are perfect. But unfortunately, when you have dogs with allergies, and this is something I want to push here, if you've got a dog that has allergies, and you're giving them bones, you might be having a problem with that. So, something to keep in mind. Yeah, yeah. Because you're living on your bones.

Rob Ryan  1:02:25

That's the point, it gets back to this thing of every dog has an innumerable amount of factors that make it unique. And that's everything from genetics to epigenetics to where it lived, how it lived before it got to you if it's a rescue. And, and then, of course, if you had it, since seven weeks, eight weeks, or whatever, what that dog was exposed to medications, therapies, vaccinations, food, all that sort of thing. Right? Yeah.

Dog Health And Longevity With A Holistic Vet 1:03:00

Rob Ryan  1:03:00

It takes a fair amount of thoughtful, sober consideration. And, that's what we do for our kids, those of us who have kids, I don't have kids, but for those of us that have kids, you do have to take, take a beat. And think about the big picture. And, I hope that most people who are watching videos like this, or at least giving, I think most people are doing this. More people are doing this now than when I was a kid. I was laughing with my mom recently; she was saying that when we were young, you never saw people walking their dogs. And now everybody walks her dogs. And something's happened in the world where people are just taking better care of the dogs. And she's right. So very,

Dr. Jeff Grognet  1:03:57

Right. Yeah, the most significant cause of one of the biggest causes of death when I first graduated, or just before that, was being hit by a car. Now, I used to do two bone surgeries every week at the hospital, and I started at, wow. So, it was a significant problem. And that wasn't all of them because a fair number were put down because of the cost of doing bone surgery. So now, I mean, fast forward to this, my last year. If we saw two a year at the practice that we hit by a car, it's like, wow, the numbers are up. Well, most of those have been run over by their mom and dad. Because they come in the driveway, and Rover comes up, Mom. Oh, and that was it. Right? I would die. So, the point is, it's all changed.

We had leash laws that made them so they don't, they're not out in the wild anymore. Are. So yeah, they're taken care of much better. And if we can extend that thing to keep caring for them much better from the holistic world, then we will have to have them here longer. You mentioned one thing about your dog being coyote-like, and I want to push this; unfortunately, it was Purina's research, but it's valid for this reason. Yeah. And that is, they had labs, either eating all they wanted, or the other group was eating 75% of what those guys ate. The difference was this: the fat guys lived an average of 11.2 years. The Lean guys live 13.2 years. So they got two more years on that diet.

Rob Ryan  1:05:51

That's great.

Dr. Jeff Grognet  1:05:51

Okay, so if you think of it from your perspective, as in, hey, the diet you're feeding, and you've got to lean mean, mean machine. Yeah. You're optimizing the longevity, just beautifully, less,

Rob Ryan  1:06:06

better metabolism, and the metabolic function of the dog is much better, but so he's, just like, with us, if we're, we're walking around with an extra 20 pounds, all of our joints have to deal with that. And the same with these dogs, so everything with dogs is compressed in time. And I remember to remind people to multiply everything by picking a number six, seven times; if you believe in that seven years, seven dog years, or something human years to one dog year, okay, so let's use seven. That's a significant number. And so you take everything, and you multiply it by seven. That's, that is what a dog is dealing with, in terms of severity of everything you're looking at, and that's what I apply to my dog. Anyway, Dr. Grognet, this has been great. We blew through over an hour. This has been. Yeah, it's been so fun to talk to you. And I want to remind people that if you go to NewEarthvet.com towards the bottom of the homepage, you'll get Dr. Grognet’s Ebook, and if anybody needs access to a great holistic vet integrative vet, pick your term. Consider doing phone consultations with great minds in veterinary medicine because we see a bunch of questions that Gussy’s Gut that we see that these people don't have an ally in the vet world that they can ask. We feel horrible because we don't give veterinary advice. And so, I wish everybody within earshot of us in this video to go out and look for a great holistic vet to consult by phone or Zoom. They're out there, folks; please look for him and get somebody great like Dr. Grognet to talk to. Anyway, thank you, Dr. Grognet, for your time, and enjoy beautiful BC for me, please.

Dr. Jeff Grognet  1:08:18

Thank you very much for having me.

Rob Ryan  1:08:21

Thank you. All right, everybody. Thank you for watching everybody. Have a great day.